Podcast Transcript: Going to Jail? She's Got Advice

Publication Information

• Publish Date: May 16, 2023
• Publication: Boston Podcast Network
• Episode Title: Going to Jail? She’s Got Advice
• Media Source: Apple Podcasts

Transcript

David Yas: [00:00:19] Boys and girls. All the ships at sea. Lovers, muggers and thieves. Welcome to the Boston podcast. My name is Dave. If you like our show, please subscribe to us on Apple Podcasts or wherever you find your podcasts. And if you want your own podcast, we can produce one for you. Go to pod617.com. To get started, it’s the Boston Podcast Network. We produce podcasts out of our Westwood, Massachusetts studios and anywhere around the world remotely. I want to get to our guest. Her name is Tara Lenich and she is the proprietor, President, King, Queen. What’s the appropriate — founder? I got that right, Tara.

Tara Lenich: [00:00:55] That’s right.

David Yas: [00:00:56] Okay. Of Liberty Advisors. I’m just getting warmed up here. It’s my first podcast of the day. Liberty Advisors LLC, providing prison consulting to help people navigate through the mysteries, the challenges, the dilemmas of serving time. I think I’ve got that right. But she’ll be the one who tells us. Let’s welcome her to the virtual studio. Yes, virtual. So how are you this morning?

Tara Lenich: [00:01:23] I’m great. Thanks so much for having me.

David Yas: [00:01:25] My pleasure. My pleasure. So very interesting topic. And see, I learned all I need to know about prison consulting services from that movie with Will Ferrell and Kevin Hart.

Tara Lenich: [00:01:38] Oh.

David Yas: [00:01:39] What was that called, Hard Time or something? Yeah. I don’t suppose you saw that movie.

Tara Lenich: [00:01:43] I did. I love it.

David Yas: [00:01:46] It’s probably got everything wrong, I’m sure. But Kevin Hart plays, I think, an ex-con who’s trying to counsel Will Ferrell on what he needs to know before he goes to prison anyway. How — this is just an interesting area to migrate to. How did you get into it?

Tara Lenich: [00:02:02] I got into it because I was a prosecutor for about a decade in New York City, and after doing that, my life took a different turn and I found myself facing prison time and the criminal legal process as a defendant.

David Yas: Really?

Tara Lenich: So yeah. So it was quite a spinner for me.

David Yas: [00:02:24] So what were the charges against you?

Tara Lenich: [00:02:26] Illegal wiretapping. And so first I faced these charges and then it was upgraded or sent over to the federal government. So I faced federal charges. So I’ve really been through both, and I also faced civil charges, a civil case. And so I now have experience in all the arenas of criminal law.

David Yas: [00:02:46] Wow. By the way, that movie was called Get Hard and please don’t see it.

Tara Lenich: [00:02:52] Ha.

David Yas: [00:02:53] It’s on point, but it’s not good. So now, when you say wiretapping, I’m thinking that would have — but I do have a law degree myself, not to brag or anything. I rarely use it. But when you say that, I think you were a prosecutor, that was part of the job. No?

Tara Lenich: [00:03:10] It was part of the job, but it wasn’t how I did it. I was actually in charge of the entire wiretapping and investigative unit at the D.A.’s office, but I did it in a manner that was not legal. So I faced those charges.

David Yas: [00:03:26] And you ended up actually serving time?

Tara Lenich: [00:03:28] I did. I served ten months at Danbury Women’s Camp in Connecticut.

David Yas: [00:03:34] Oh, well, that’s like going to tennis camp. No, I’m just kidding. I’m just kidding. It must have been — I mean, for someone coming from the professional world like you do and the sort of — I don’t know if irony is the right word, but it was your job to, in layman’s terms, put bad people away. That must have been very humbling. What was it like?

Tara Lenich: [00:03:56] It really was. The first experience — it’s like your stomach drops and you feel like you’re going to vomit, and then it’s okay, what am I going to do? And actually, as a prosecutor, I spent a significant period of time with confidential informants and people that were in prison. And so I knew kind of what to expect. But yourself being there is very different. My only concern going in really was: am I going to get beat up? And is anyone going to know I’m a prosecutor? And so that was really a safety concern for me. Was anyone going to be there that I had a hand in putting in prison?

David Yas: [00:04:34] Sure. Yeah. My ex-wife is a prosecutor. And we had to avoid certain breakfast joints, like the IHOP. We had to avoid certain places. She was afraid she’d see her former defendants. But I don’t want to belabor this because I want to get to your company. But what were the accommodations like? To use a weird term.

Tara Lenich: [00:05:07] They’re certainly not like anything you’re used to. We weren’t in cells, so we didn’t have doors that close, but it was still a six by six area with bunk beds and one little locker. So privacy is a real issue. And you can get involved and do work, or you can do the easier jobs. So I first worked in the library and taught classes, and then I was like, you know what? I’m going to make the most of my time here and learn something new. So I joined the construction crew, and I learned how to set a toilet and put up drywall. And so there really is — if you want to learn a trade, it’s actually the place where you learn those things.

David Yas: [00:05:56] And you must have been a quick learner. You were only there for ten months. So you didn’t get beat up, I take it.

Tara Lenich: [00:06:04] No. And I think that’s one of the things — in my practice, there are certain things you need to know about how to act in certain situations. And the bottom line is really just always treat everybody with respect, which you should be doing anyways, right? And stay in your own lane and don’t pick a fight. It’s not that difficult if you just follow some simple, basic rules.

David Yas: [00:06:27] It’s sounding pretty good right now. So when you came out, you still had your law degree. But I’m going to guess that they don’t let you back into the bar.

Tara Lenich: [00:06:48] Oh no. I’m pretty much banned for life from New York. Connecticut, I can reapply in a couple of years. But I needed to find something to use my skill set. I went through all this legal training and I really enjoyed the arena of criminal law. So while I was inside, I talked to a bunch of the other women — we had all hired prison consultants or someone that we thought would help us in some way, and no one really panned out. So I started formulating this while I was still in Danbury. Like, what am I going to do? I need to have a plan for when I get out of here. And so I started taking classes as soon as I got out to be a mitigation specialist. And I looked more into what it really means to be a prison consultant. And I decided this really fit my skill set. I really like to help people. I have so much knowledge on both sides of the criminal justice system. I can tell my clients, “Oh, this is what it’s like. This is what the prosecutor is most likely looking at. These are the things that you need to be aware of.” And also from a defense standpoint, like what’s it going to be like each one of those days in court? How are you going to feel? How’s your family going to feel?

David Yas: [00:07:57] No, no, please finish your thought.

Tara Lenich: [00:08:00] I really feel like families aren’t supported. It was incredibly difficult for my family to face this process and not have anyone really to ask questions about what’s going to happen, what’s expected of them, how am I doing without making me more stressed out? And so that’s something I really thought was not addressed. Defense attorneys have limited time and they’re really focusing on legal issues, and I can take some of that burden off of them and help the client and their loved ones prepare. Just knowing what to expect and how to prepare for each stage really helps people who are going through this traumatic experience have a tiny bit of semblance of control.

David Yas: [00:08:41] Yeah. At what point do people typically call you up?

Tara Lenich: [00:08:47] It varies. I would say the earlier I get involved, the better. If you find out you’re under federal investigation, now is the time to hire a prison consultant or Liberty Advisors. Because there are certain things you can start doing right away. You can start preparing if you know you’re the target of the investigation. Charges are likely coming and coming soon because they’ve been investigating you for a while. So what steps can you take? How do you start preparing your life for what you’re about to face? And that’s things that we provide — practical support and preparation for. What comes next? What do I need to do? And what’s it going to be like when I have to go through a media circus in front of a federal courthouse in Boston? And how do I deal with my family at arraignment and what do I do to post bail? So as soon as you can get help, get help by hiring a defense counsel that you’re happy with. And then the next step would be look at a firm like Liberty Advisors and see how they can help you.

David Yas: [00:09:52] So I can tell you right now, the perp walk — I mean, that’s easy. You’ve got one, two, three options. You go with the defiance where you just kind of walk with your head high and that just says, you know what? I’m innocent. This is all B.S. Or you do the incognito where you find some jacket that isn’t yours, but you throw it over your head and then you have trouble walking. Or you do the Mike Tyson where you just laugh and show your cuffs to the camera.

Tara Lenich: [00:10:24] I think I tried number one. Number two never looked good.

David Yas: [00:10:33] So when people come to you and let’s say for the sake of this hypothetical that they’re facing prison — they’re definitely going to prison. And they’re someone who, like I’m sure a lot of people, never thought this would happen to them. They sit down with you. What’s the first thing that you tell them?

Tara Lenich: [00:10:56] I’d say this is one moment in your life. You’re going to get through this. There will be a light at the end of the tunnel. And just keep that in mind throughout the whole process because you’re going to face some bad times — you think it’s horrible now and there are going to be some really rough patches — but you’re going to get through this. And the best way to get through it is to have knowledge and to prepare. Because you are completely out of control at this time in your life, and this is the way you can take some control and have some level of calmness. And so I really walk them through — and their families. I think it’s really important for someone to know, listen, your family will be supported through this. You’re not on an island by yourself. There’s a team here for you. You can ask me any questions. There’s absolutely no judgment. I mean, I’ve been through it. Just feel free to ask me any questions. Talk to me. Ask the questions you’re afraid to ask anyone else. And we’re going to stay in touch with your defense attorney to make sure that we’re all working on this case for you.

David Yas: [00:11:56] Yeah, I imagine — just going by stereotypes here — but the moms in particular will need counsel. But here’s my thing. If I ever went to prison, it would be horrible, of course. But I would first think of my mom and how much she’d be worrying all the time. I was in a fraternity in college and there was this very innocuous assignment where our little brother had to call our parents and ask for a baby photo — just for a silly little presentation. It’s actually the most non-fraternity, non-hazing thing ever. But yet my mom, because it was a fraternity, the first thing she says to my little brother is, “I’m a prosecutor. And if you touch one hair on my baby’s head, I will prosecute you to the full extent of the law.” So you must deal with a lot of really anxious parents, spouses, siblings. Am I right?

Tara Lenich: [00:13:01] Absolutely. And even though I had been in the criminal justice system for over a decade, my parents hadn’t. My friends were like, what is going on? And so just to say to them, like, this is how you can help. This is what’s going to be expected. And your loved one really is okay right now. I think having someone tell them that who has been through it means something. Attorneys are helpful, but they’re so busy dealing with the legal issues. They don’t have the time to sit down and hold the mom’s hand. I can do that. And I can be there if they want to call me at 10:00 at night or the next morning and say, like, I was really stressing out and I feared the worst. And I can say, okay, listen, I understand where you’re coming from, but this is what you can do.

David Yas: [00:13:49] Right. And I imagine — well, let me ask you this. Do you keep in touch with your clients while they’re on the inside?

Tara Lenich: [00:14:02] I definitely do, if they want me to. And I think it’s important to maintain that contact because they’re also going to need help when they come out. Everyone counts down the whole time that you’re in. The one thing you know is your release date. And the one thing you’re working towards is getting out. But when you get out, the world isn’t necessarily the same — even ten months later for me. Things had happened. I lost my dog. There were family issues. And everyone has that. And it’s like, okay, now I have to reintegrate. Especially if you’ve been away for five, seven, nine years. How has the world changed around you? And we really help people come back into the world. Like, okay, you need to get your finances back in order. This is all put on hold. This is where your life is. Let’s get you a job. So we can support them and help them find services, employment, or housing that they need.

David Yas: [00:14:57] Now one service that you offer — sentence advocacy — which I wouldn’t necessarily intuitively have thought to be part of what you do. But you can look at your client’s history and help devise a strategy for probation. Which to me would be invaluable. You’re a former prosecutor. You certainly know. I imagine some of the job is on the lawyer for that. Or maybe not. Tell me about that part.

Tara Lenich: [00:15:23] It’s definitely both. You work very closely with the defense team in this way. And what they usually ask us to do is create reports, use video, help the client tell their story, and make sure the court is looking beyond this one moment in the client’s life and considering all the aspects of their past lives. It really helps if you can find any factors that may have influenced how this client arrived in their current predicament. And so we create these reports. But I really think the cornerstone to it all — you’re exactly right — is with probation and the court. You really don’t want to be telling your story for the first time at sentencing and probation hearings. You want to have refined your speech so you’re speaking more naturally, and you’re talking about yourself and what happened, and you’re the best advocate for yourself. If you can really come to grips with what happened, what you did, and talk about it as eloquently and naturally as you can, that’s in everybody’s best interest. And that’s really how we can help take some burden off of the defense team. But I would never do all of this without consulting along the way with the defense counsel, because we want to make sure that we’re following what they have planned for the case, what they think is most important. They’re going to know the judges pretty well. They’re sometimes going to know the individual probation officers very well. And so each one is tailored for that purpose.

David Yas: [00:17:07] Well, I already knew of that from that one scene in The Shawshank Redemption when the Morgan Freeman character finally persuades the parole board to let him out. He says, “I look at that young man…”

Tara Lenich: [00:17:29] I wish every client could talk like that, but they can’t. Not everyone is Morgan Freeman.

David Yas: [00:17:34] Absolutely right. And I’m just demonstrating why people need to hire you, Tara, because I think a lot of people have their conception of the prison system from Law and Order and movies and things like that. What are some misconceptions about the prison system that you help dispel?

Tara Lenich: [00:17:50] I think the first thing is that this is going to take a long time. People think it’s going to be over fast — it’ll be over in a couple of weeks. But you’re usually under investigation for months, if not years. I’ve known of investigations lasting for years. And they also think they either think every phone is tapped and there are hidden cameras put everywhere, or they have the opposite belief that no one cares and no one’s following them. Usually neither one of those things are true. And so just trying to make them understand how the prosecutors are coming at this. But they also say, “Oh my God, my life is going to be over. I’m in prison.” No, your life is not going to be over. It’s one time in your life and you’re going to get through it, and we’re going to make sure that you have the support you need. And I think that’s one of the big things that we do at Liberty Advisors — we collect a lot of character reference letters from people that the client knows: loved ones, teachers, neighbors, anyone that they’ve had a close relationship with. And the defense attorney can use those in their submission to the court, or they may choose not to use them. But I always think it’s valuable to do it because it’s important for the client to know they’re supported. Because a lot of people have the misconception that now I’m alone, I’m on this island, no one’s there for me. And we can show them: No, not only am I there for you, but people also remember all these good things that you did in the past. And I think it’s important to have that to go back to when the client’s facing this traumatic experience.

David Yas: [00:19:23] Absolutely. So you’ve persuaded me and you’ll be my first call the next time I get a speeding ticket or something. But tell people: what’s the best way to find out more about Liberty Advisors and everything you do?

Tara Lenich: [00:19:37] You can go to my website, which is www.libertyadvisorsllc.com, or they can email me at [email protected].

David Yas: [00:19:51] Excellent. We have the clock here, but I thank you so much for joining me and I really want to congratulate you. I make jokes all the time. But seriously, what a story for you to come back from what you came back from and be helping people who are going through what you went through. So congratulations.

Tara Lenich: [00:20:10] Thanks. I really appreciate it. Thanks for having me.

David Yas: [00:20:13] And once again, go to LibertyAdvisorsLLC.com to learn more about Tara and everything she does. If you or someone you know needs her services, give her a ring. And by the way, Tara, anywhere in the country?

Tara Lenich: [00:20:26] Anywhere in the country.

David Yas: [00:20:27] Very good. Thanks for listening to the Boston Podcast. If you dig the show, please follow us on Apple Podcasts. Go to pod617.com if you want your own podcast — we’ll produce it for you.